Is a garage suitable for a permanent layout?

[debe45]

I have recently moved house and now have a detached garage in which to build a permanent layout.

My buildings are cardbuild Metcalf and I wish to leave my locos etc, on the track.

The garage is dry but unheated.  Do or should I add some insulation to the walls or what steps should I take to use the garage.  The layout will use a side and back wall.

Thanks for all and any advice, especially from those who might use or have used an external garage.

 

Derek

[NWR-Gordon-4]

Personally I would not put a layout in a garage, but not to say you shouldn't build one inside of one. If you do, my biggest suggestion is that you make sure the garage is weatherproof.

 

GNR-Gordon-4 (HF)

[Rog RJ]

How is the garage constructed?  Is it brick, concrete, wood etc  What's the roof made of?

Does it have its own electric supply?

[JJ73]

Yeah I've never put a train layout in a Garage before but I second what Jacob (Gordon) say above - make sure it is weatherproof - i.e. make sure no rain can get in & no damp either, also how surure is it - you don't want to find that people can get in easy - has the doors on the garage got good locks on them???

[walkingthedog]

A garage is fine but it must be watertight, well insulated and of course secure. It will need to be heated in the winter and ventilated in the summer. A friend of mine had a garage layout but always put the locos away when not in use.

[NWR-Gordon-4]

That's a good idea WTD, about storing the locomotives and rolling stock away in boxes when not in use.

 

GNR-Gordon-4 (HF)

[2e0dtoeric]

Put away IN THE HOUSE - to make them harder to borrow on a permanent basis without asking!!  😛

Heat in winter, ventilate in summer, or you will alternatly roast or freeze!

Installed mains power is a must. Do not rely n a long extension cable from the kitchen or somewhere.

[37lover]

My layout is in a secure and well insulated room, that I built, inside my double garage; I have a 80W tubular heater via a thermostat that keeps it above 14 degrees C. Also got an LP player and stack of records to compete against the few sound locos I have. Never had any problems, except walking round to the side door in very cold weather  😀. I also have a lot of well sealed card buildings on the layout

[walkingthedog]

Models trains and music. Sounds perfect to me 37. 

[37lover]

I have mentioned previously, and posted some photos, of some wagons [in this sense the tanker type] that I built in recognition of a trial in Scotland many years ago for transporting whisky. It didn't prove economical because of the volume limits imposed by Insurance companies. But running my train, with a glass in hand, and a bit of music is very relaxing.

[john205480]

I have done a layout in a double garage of concrete panel construction with no issues .But because it's not heated I cover it in the winter and move the rolling stock into the house .I have another layout in a fully insulated and heated summer house to use when it gets really cold .Fully insulating a garage is possible but outside my budget .I tend to run a scalextric track in there in the winter which is more forgiving and fun .

[debe45]

My garage is a single wall red brick on visible wall and breize block the two wall next to niehgbours fence.  It has light and power and does not leak.  So heat I can have when I am playing trains and an open door can cool the place,  But is that enough, should I add some insulation? If so what sort and on what walls? Should I as 37lover suggests have a space heater to keep garage at nominal temp? Or will it be enough just to heat me.

Thanks to all who have made suggestions a photo of your room 37lover would help me if you can provide one,

Thanks all

Regards

Derek

 

[atom3624]

One thought in this 'modern age' is privacy and security.

A garage can easily be alarmed, but access isn't THAT difficult with anyone able to see inside.

 

How close is the garage to 'outside' and 'general passers by' including the all-too-common' dog walkers?

Most are 100% genuine, but MANY are not.

If on one of those 'need to have the door open' days there is too-easy viewing access to anyone passing by ....

 

Just a thought.

Al.

[37lover]

Derek,

I am happy to post a few photos but they will need approval so will not show until at least Monday. I will write another post describing the room size and materials I used before Monday. My room is insulated on all six faces! The tube heater is very cost effective, it is surprising how much heat comes out of a 80w tube heater! Yes, I know some smart Alec will say not more than 80 watts but because it is constant background in cold weather it manages fine.

[morairamike]

The weak link as far as insulation is concerned is the door. If it's an up Nd over then the gaps around the sides, top and bottom are big enough to drive a car through. If a roller door then they are better but still allow drafts in down the runners. If you have another entrance then consider using marine plywood to face, the complete wall and door and then line the complete garage with foil faced expanded foam sheets, Celotex.

[96RAF]

The house I am looking to buy in UK has had the detached single garage converted into a professional photo studio by replacing the garage door with a domestic door and window arrangement.

 

The inside has been dry lined and insulated with a ceiling installed with downspot lights. There is proper power and heating in there via a consumer unit and a laminated wooden floor over insulation panels. There is also a boarded out loft for storage.

 

An added bonus is because it was used for a business their insurers demanded hi level external security cameras which I am negotiating for them to leave in place.

 

Unfortunately all my previously settled draft layout plans will need to be adjusted again for length and width.

 

Rob

[2e0dtoeric]

Unfortunately all my previously settled draft layout plans will need to be adjusted again - -

That's part of the fun!!  😛

[debe45]

Thanks all for the hints and tips.  I think it is a goer after some minor alterations are made and I will try a low power heater 37.

 

Thanks

PS  This will probably take years to implement.

[2e0dtoeric]

Atom's post - A garage can easily be alarmed

reminded me of an old sticker I saw - "This car is not easily frightened - but it IS alarmed!" 😎

[atom3624]

Too true!!

[NWR-Gordon-4]

PS  This will probably take years to implement.

 

Years is better than decades!  😉 😆 😉

 

GNR-Gordon-4 (HF)

[atom3624]

Careful planning and implementation is all part of the fun - enjoy it!!

 

Al.

[PJ_model_trains]

Like the layout, where we put it is of prime importance I think.

 

I have had two layouts as many of you know, each one larger than the previous, my third is due to start in March. Why March? Because I feel preparation and getting things right from the start is important.

 

We moved home in June last year but due to other works my trains have been on hold, that is until now.

 

The new layout is going in my garage, so like you guys that have done this or are planning to do it, warm, dry and secure are important factors, so is condensation.

 

The garage is brick built, timber and felt roof with some insulation in the roof. The roof was replaced in December so I know that is as safe as it can be. The back garage door has been changed to a multi locking, insulated, double glazed door. The front garage door is up and over and can be a little draughty at times, neither of these are an issue.

 

Inside the garage door studding has been placed, between the studding and on the face of it is 60mm Celuform insulation. This gives 120mm on the coldest part, but also leaves air movement behind the Celutex.

 

the side panels of th garage have 1"/25mm pressure treated battens fixed horizontally to the wall, onto these is fixed 60mm Celutex insulation boards 8x4/2400x1200. The air from the up and over door can get behind the Celutex boards sheets, this is very important to stop interstitual condensation forming behind. The studding behind the front up and over door prevents it from being opened.

 

The studding and boarding to the front is almost complete, along with wiring to a fused spur, which will take a flat panel infrared heater and stat. A normal heater for this size room would be around 2Kw, the infrared only requires 700w, they are economical to run, but not cheap to buy. £250. I have purchased one with a separete thermostat timer, so I can keep the area at a moderate 50 degrees and raise it when I am in the train room. Infrared is instant heat.

 

The insulation and over boarding with MDF and emulsioned, with heater fitted and 40" TV on one wall should be complete for me by end January. February the boards and legs will be made and installed with BUS' added for DCC, Accessories, LD and Lighting.

 

March I hope to start laying track and building the layout. I can't wait but do think all the preparation is worth it and needed.

 

The layout I propose to add is: 

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[37lover]

@debe45,

Derek,

As requested here are a few details and there should be another post with photos appearing after approval. I am very fortunate that my garage is much wider than a double and I had space to build a self enclosed room for my layout. However, here is what I did.

 

My garage external walls are solid brick. I fixed two horizontal battens and then vertical timbers [2" x 3"] at 2ft centres to the external walls. Traditional studding centres would be 16" but I don't expect heavy loading on my walls. I then packed the voids with roof/loft insulation before covering with 1/2" plasterboard, applied tape to the joints but otherwise that was the finished job. My garage roof is flat and the rafters are 8" or so deep so I used rigid insulation boards between the rafters and then fixed 1/2" plasterboard. My partition wall was built using 3" x 2" studding faced both sides with the plasterboard and again filled with loft insulation.

 

The concrete floor of my garage had a slope to the front so covered with a plastic sheet and then laid treated timber battens of increasing thickness at right angles to the slope before fixing 3" x 2" joists to give a level floor. The gaps between the joists were packed with loft insulation before covering with tongue & groove chipboard panels. An alternative for a flat floor could be to lay expanded polystyrene panels [2", 3", 4" thick] and then some sort of topping.

 

I have a door to the room which is a great advantage as others have mentioned about heat loss and draughts that you may get from your garage doors. A lot depends on the type of garage door(s) you have but it still should be possible to insulate them and if you do not intend using them then fixing a heavy duty plastic sheet across the inside overlapping the edges would be a simple and effective way to reduce the draughts.

 

I have posted photos of my layout previously so I'll see if I can narrow the dates and let you know in my next post.

 

Regards

Martin

[Chrissaf]

I would agree with everything 37L has wrote. A room created within a Garage is the way to go if space permits and a Garage is the only free space available. One big advantage that 37L didn't mention. Is with such a sealed inner enclosure, the ingress of spiders creating cobwebs, black atmospheric dust and other creepy crawlies should be very much reduced compared to a relatively unsealed Garage environment.